並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/za/podcast/ep43-%E6%AD%8C%E6%89%8B-%E5%8B%95%E5%8A%9B%E7%81%AB%E8%BB%8A-%E9%A1%8F%E5%BF%97%E7%90%B3-%E5%B0%A4%E7%A7%8B%E8%88%88%E4%BE%86%E5%95%A6-%E6%90%96%E6%BB%BE%E5%A4%A9%E5%9C%98%E7%B0%BD%E5%94%B1%E6%9C%83%E7%AB%9F%E6%9B%BE%E5%8F%AA7%E4%BA%BA/id1530715663?i=1000518540562