並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep37-%E7%81%AB%E7%81%BD%E9%A9%9A%E9%AD%82%E8%A8%98%E8%88%87%E5%B9%BC%E5%85%92%E5%9C%92%E9%9B%A3%E9%A1%8C/id1516362943?i=1000500007596